›                                 GOE Conference››                                      with››                                 David Sullivan›                                  <D.SULLIVAN4>››                                       of››                              Total Control Systems››››                                November 3, 1988››››             Copyright 1988 by GEnie and The Atari 8-bit RoundTable››    May  be  freely  distributed so long as the text, the copyright notice,›    and  this  notice  remain intact and unchanged.  May be reformatted for›    printing or publishing purposes.››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> I'd like to welcome everyone to the RTC with David›    Sullivan of TCS.  David will be talking tonight about the GOE system, a›    new ST-Like desktop for the Atari 8-bits.  This is a FORMAL conference.›    That  means  that to ask a question, you MUST raise your hand by typing›    /RAI.    First  off,  I'd like for David to make a few opening comments›    about TCS and GOE.  Go ahead, David!››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok.  Basically,  TCS has been in business since›    1984  and  has  written several BBS systems.  GOE is one of our current›    products,  a  64k  bank  select operating environment that gives you an›    ST-like interface.  (gh)››    <[RT*SysOp]  MARTY.A>  Sounds  interesting,  David!  I really liked the›    demo.  If anyone has a question, please type /RAI to ask it!››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Thanks.  A patch to the demo will be up for DOS›    II users later tonight.››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Ah!  Bob Puff has a question››    <BOB.PUFF>  Hi Dave!  Here's my Q...  Exactly how is your 64K cart bank›    selected?  Using  the $d5xx page? and are there any potential conflicts›    with other hardware devices using this page? Oss carts? etc... ga››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> Ok. The 64k cartridge is the same basic cart used›    in  ICD's  SpartaDOS X.  It uses the cartridge control block ($D5xx) to›    switch  banks.  Upon release, there will be no problems with the OSS or›    ICD  carts.  However, carts like the Proburner and Microsota's RAM-CART›    will not work. ga››    <BOB.PUFF>  ok  well  if you are using the same addresses as sdx, won't›    that mess it up?››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> No. I am using a cart made by ICD, although both›    carts use the same control area in memory, there are enough differences›    that  each  knows what the other is doing and they work great together.›    Just  as  BASICxe works with SPX, GOE works with the OSS and ICD carts.›    ga››    <BOB.PUFF> Hmm Ok I see... so it goes ok with OSS carts though, right?››    <[David] D.SULLIVA4> Yes.››    <BOB.PUFF> ok thanks! ga››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> OK!  Thanks, Bob!  Next is E.R.Presley....››    <[DR.  WHO] E.PRESLEY1> THANKS... Are there any possible conflicts that›    can occur with GOE and disk programs (ie overwriting GOE) in memory. ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> GOE turns itself OFF while loading programs that›    require 48k, GOE remains transparent to all existing software. ga››    <[DR.  WHO]  E.PRESLEY1>  what about software that uses memory under os›    and extended memory? will it protect itself somewhere? ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  GOE does NOT use extended memory (under the OS)›    and,  also,  you  tell GOE if and when it is to use the extra memory in›    the xe machines. ie banks 1...4 or above. ga››    <[DR. WHO] E.PRESLEY1> thanks Dave...ga››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Next is M.SAVAGE››    <M.SAVAGE>  HI  DAVE.  HOW does goe compare to the GEOS program for the›    commodores? ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok.  Comparing  to  GEOS  is  not  likely to be›    suitable.    GEOS  does  not maintain more than one window or provide a›    clean  and  clear  way to program it.  GOE is much faster (2 to 3 fold)›    and  is  completely  programmable.  Down to the icons being used on the›    Desktop.  ga››    <M.SAVAGE> what do you see as being the most applicable way to use goe?››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> GOE, as a Desktop, can be used in many way...with›    the  addition of other GOE applications, GOE becomes a powerful tool in›    using  your  8bit  from  day to day. On the programming end, GOE can be›    used  to  make  your  programming  an  easier  job  and provide flashes›    graphics in an interactive environment.  ga››    <M.SAVAGE>  sounds good! thanks for the answers. ga››    <[RT*SysOp]  MARTY.A> OK, thanks so far.  Just a reminder, type /RAI to›    ask a question.  Next is G.R.DIAZ....››    <G.R.DIAZ>  Well  I  would  like  to  thank  Dave  for such a fine demo›    firstly.    I  don't know if its appropriate or not but I purchased the›    "other" OS just recently and found your DEMO to be of a higher caliber.›    Anyway...  One question I have is with respect to the demo applications›    on the disk... will they be on the the cart?››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  OK.    Thanks  for  the  compliments!  The CART›    contains  the main desktop (goDesk) and the main OS.  Including several›    fonts,  icons and three accessories.  The Control Panel, Calculator and›    a  Note-Pad.   Other features of the cart are a memory manager and disk›    manager.    These  control  the GOE application's use of memory and the›    disk.    The  goPaint and goWrite applications are disk based as is the›    Icon Editor and Font Editor.  ga››    <G.R.DIAZ> ok that sounds good, I'll ask other questions later. Thanks.›    ga››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Next is Jack Dewell from Atari Corp....››    <MR.GOODPROBE>  Thanks!  Hi,  Dave! I certainly agree with GRDiaz about›    the relative merits of the other.  Got a release date on the cart?››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok.  The release dates are not 100% firm.  I am›    in  the  final  stages  of  testing with the cart and ironing out those›    final  few  (shall  we  say)  undocumented features.  I expect that the›    carts will be around in about two to two and a half weeks. ga››    <MR.GOODPROBE>  ok! Are you going to ship a cart to John Skruch so that›    *I*   can  test  it  (drool  slaver),  and  how  far  along  are  those›    applications? I know...patience patience. ga››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> The carts to ICD (a rom actually), Atari Corp and›    several magazines are about 10 days off.  (Yes, John will get one)››    <MR.GOODPROBE> ok! thanks! next!››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks, Jack!  Next is D.MELICHAR››    <D.MELICHAR>  Are  you  currently in negotiations with Atari concerning›    packaging the GOE with the Atari computers in the future. ga.››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok.    First,  a  missed ? from Jack. The first›    application  is  about  two  weeks off (goPaint).  Now.  As for talking›    with  Atari, Corp.  I have had several conversations, at this point the›    main  objective  is  to  get the cart complete and out.  I can say that›    exec.  from Atari has seen and is interested in the progress and future›    of GOE. You on GEnie will be the first to know if anything more arises.›    ga››    <D.MELICHAR> Thank you.  Be back later with a question from Mike B.  ga››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks!  Next up is Wayne.....››    <[WAYNE]  W.ALBUS>  I AM INTERESTED IN KNOWING HOW THE PROPOSED 80 COL.›    TERMINAL PROGRAM WILL WORK.››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> The 80 column goTerm terminal program will allow›    users  with monochrome monitors or composite color monitors to access a›    full  64 or 80 columns.  XEP80 owners will also be supported in goTerm.›    BASICALLY,  other than the XEP80, GOE uses a software 4 point character›    set to allow 80 columns.  ga››    <[WAYNE] W.ALBUS> OK DAVID THANKS GA.››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> OK!  Now, Mark has a question.....››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1>  Thanks.  Great  demo  Dave.  Now, when programming›    within  the environment will there be a set-up similar to Atari's OS in›    that  you  set  parameters  and JSR CIOV, or is it something different,›    such as the (arrgh) C-64 Kernel?  Ga.››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> Ok. On the machine (GOE's) level the programming›    is through a vector (aka Kernal) that then processes the command.  From›    Mac65, Macro's are used to allow easy access to the commands from Atari›    BASIC,  a  simple  use  call is used. In most cases you set the x and y›    coords. or appropriate parameters and then call GOE.  To get technical,›    a  simple  call to plot a dot may look like LDA #_PLOTDOT, JMP 0, .BYTE›    X,Y or from Mac65 a macro is used (ie PLOTDOT X,Y). ga››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1>  Ok, great. Also, what kind of screen set-up do you›    use? Such as a Gr.8 screen or something else. ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok  the  screen  layouts  are  320x200, 320x192›    (graphics 8) and the wide mode 480x200 and 480x192.  The default screen›    is 320x200.  ga››    <[Mark] M.GAMBER1> Ok, thanks. Looking forward to it! I'm done. Next!››    <[RT*SysOp]   MARTY.A>   Thanks!      Next....Bob   Puff   has  another›    question.....››    <BOB.PUFF>  Hi again.. Ok please excuse my ignorance in this question..›    I've   been   switching   between   two  systems,  and  haven't  caught›    everything..  What is the basic purpose of GOE? is it a mouse interface›    for a DOS menu? to load files? ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  GOE, on the desktop level is a 'mouse interface›    for  a  DOS  menu'  that  allows  you  to  manipulate files.  But, even›    further,  GOE  allows  alternate  GOE applications to also take control›    over  the mouse environment and provide windows icons, drop down menus,›    pop  up menus, dialog boxes and other various 'st-like' features to the›    Atari  8bit.    Plus, GOE handles a character set (font) generator that›    allows  up to 32 point fonts (or down to 4 point) for viewing and using›    in documents or pictures.  ga››    <BOB.PUFF>  I  guess  I  see..  Ok. Another question...  What utilities›    will  be  on the cart? Will the cart be like another "drive" as in SDX,›    or how will programs load?››    <[David]   D.SULLIVAN4>   The   cart   contains  several  programs  and›    accessories  in  it, like SPX, but it is not on the CIO level so to use›    those utilities, you must be in the GOE environment.  Programs that use›    GOE,  ie.  goPaint, are able to access all of the features of the cart.›    ga››    <BOB.PUFF>  So  what  programs  do you have NOW, and projected programs›    that make use of this?››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> Right now.  The cart contains the desktop, three›    accessories.    On disk, we have an Icon Editor, Font Editor, Arc Shell›    :-)  and various demo's for the environment.  The next two applications›    are goPaint (a complete paint program) that resembles Atari's NEOchrome›    in style and allows importing of DEGAS, NEOchrome and MacPaint pics. as›    well  as  C64  pictures.  The word processor goWrite is a full features›    word  processor  with  multiple  fonts and font sizes (and editability)›    that  can  even  handle  Clip  art from the paint program. ie text wrap›    around  it.  Those two (goPaint and goWrite) are currently being worked›    on.    goPaint  is to beta test stage and goWrite is a little ways off.›    The  future  plans  are goTerm, a terminal.  goBase, a DataBase and the›    most  important goPublish, a complete(!) desktop publishing system that›    has the capabilities that others should have.  (we have tested the idea›    and it looks very good).  GA››    <BOB.PUFF>  Did  I  hear ARC?! hehe it works nicely, huh? I'm surprised›    arc  outputs  to the redefined E:... Any glitches?  ga (sounds good for›    all the rest)››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  The ArcShell is currently for ICD's SPX ARC and›    captures  the  E:  info to a file, ie. redirection then put's it into a›    window.    I am currently experimenting with you 'SuperArc' now.  Looks›    like a little bit of work.  GA››    <BOB.PUFF> ok well I am now using ICPTL of iocb #0 to send output... It›    works just as well, but showed up a bug in spartados. ok thanks for the›    answers... ga››    <[RT*SysOp]  MARTY.A>  Thanks,  Bob!    Next  is  G.R.Diaz with another›    question....››    <G.R.DIAZ>  THANKS  MARTY!  Whoo, this is looking really good!  I had a›    few  more  questions  and I will just list them all now...  1.  The $50›    deal, I saw this after I download the demo, did you get my message?  2.›    Will  goWrite  support  the  XEP80?      3.  I noticed the mouse cursor›    movement  "dragged"  a  little bit.  Will that be improved in the cart?›    4.  Will SpartaDOS be supported through the windowing?  5. lastly, will›    CLIs be available?  ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> Ok.  The $50 deal...the $50 special introductory›    offer  is  still  on for GEnie members and user groups.  Contact us via›    EMAIL  or phone if you are unsure about this.  'SOME PEOPLE' have asked›    when,  if, why, how, etc. ...on to #2...  goWrite supports the XEP80 in›    edit  and  preview  modes  WHEN using the XEP80, the multiple fonts and›    font sizes and styles are disabled or very limited we are still working›    on  that  at this point.  The XEP80 can not do too much more than basic›    80  column  text  output.    #3:   The mouse speed dragging.  This is a›    problem  that  is partially because of speed, GOE manipulates the mouse›    in  pixels,  not  as  a  player  (to  avoid  the possible hiding behind›    playfield 0).  The flickering has been improved and the speed bumped up›    so that there is very very little dragging.  ie, when you move an Icon,›    you  still  get  a little bit.  GOE uses a POKEY interrupt and from the›    control  panel  that can be retimed to speed up or slow down the mouse.›    ? #4,  SpartaDOS through a window (is really like #5) is something that›    we  are  working  on  as  a  CLI-type  accessory.   It creates a lot of›    problems  with  SpartaDOS X.  But good ol' SpartaDOS II and Atari DOS's›    should be able to do this.  The answer is YES, we are currently working›    on that.  When complete it will be PD.  ga››    <G.R.DIAZ> Ok, that sounds REALLY good..››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Next is Mark again....››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1>  Thanks  Marty...  Dave, how many is "Some people"?›    Has there been a lot of interest generated? Offhand, that is...  ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> Ok.  Basically, I have had 'ok' response so far,›    as  expected before a product is released.  With two competing products›    (ie  the  'other')  on  the  market I don't know what the total/overall›    response  is going to be.  To date we have taken several advance orders›    (approx 2/3 of the initial order of carts) and currently have a mailing›    list  of  672 (oops, 673, got a call tonight) people who are interested›    and  would  like  a flyer.  As for interest from other developers.  The›    response is basically as usual, a wait and see attitude.  GA››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1> Ok. Well, I think you can expect my check! Also, on›    a relative basis, how easy is it to program within the environment?  As›    in,  would it be easier to make your own handlers and just use GOE as a›    FMS?  GA››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Very  easy!  The GOE cart comes with a hobbyist›    guide  to  programming  and the source to the three Desk Accessories to›    get  people started.  GOE is easier to program than CIO (which is easy)›    if that gives you an example.  GA››    <[Mark] M.GAMBER1> Ok, finally, (really) You mentioned $50. Now, if I'm›    to  send you a check, EXACTLY, with shipping and handling do I send and›    where do I send it and who do I make it out to?  GA››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok.   To GEnie users, as the DEMO says, the $50›    discount  is  good  to  the next 20.  Lets make that 30...(why not),...›    wish  prepay,  the cart total is $53 ($3 shipping) and a check would be›    made  out  to:   Total Control Systems.  The address is 4156 Tolowa St.›    San  Diego,  CA.  92117  ....  try reading cat 5, top 24 if you get the›    chance  or  loose the address.  It is also in the DEMO.  or leave EMAIL›    to D.SULLIVAN4.   GA››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1>  Ok,  just  making  sure. Thanks much, Dave. I'm so›    beside myself, there's 3 of me here! Thanks again!››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> OK!  Next, D.MELICHAR is up again.....››    <D.MELICHAR>  David,  the  WICO trak ball is not supported very well in›    the demo, will support be there in the cart. 1st release or will you be›    releasing an update later in the year? ga››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> Ok.  Basically the cart currently supports the ST›    mouse  Atari Joystick, Keyboard and Koala Pad (paddles) BUT, to make it›    'more'  compatible  I added a 'reverse' field option to the X & Y along›    with  swap  X & Y.  This allows the SuperRAT (Zobian), Atari Touch Pad,›    and  others to work.  As for the Wico, I am trying to find one locally.›    If it does not make it into the CART, a driver will be on GEnie as soon›    as it is complete.  I have also recently been testing the Lightgun (ie.›    Light Pen).  GA››    <D.MELICHAR>  Did  you  get  my package today?  I will send you my WICO›    trakball  tomorrow  and  then  you will have one to use.  You mentioned›    that  MacPaint  and others would be supported in GOpaint, will you have›    support for viewing/editing GIF/RLE pics?  ga››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> Yes (on the package, thanks.  I also got the same›    from  a  local  store.  Still thanks).  On the Wico, if you send it, it›    will  be  return  within a week or two.  On goPaint, I do not currently›    have  the specs on GIF & RLE formats.  However, I will investigate that›    as  time  permits  and  at  least  provide  a conversion utility in GOE›    format.   GA››    <D.MELICHAR> Ok thanks David.  As a side note RLE pics are used on "the›    other  service"  and  are  viewed  on  some BBS's with Vidtex mode from›    Tscope etc. thanks again.  Be talking to you!  ga››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> Ok Thanks. GA››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> OK.....Moving right along..... Gary is up next....››    <[Gary]   G.E.M.>   David,   back  to  GoWrite  and  the  XEP80  for  a›    minute...(BTW  the WICO trackball emulates a joystick, it is not a true›    trackball)...    Will  GoWrite  support  the XEP's ability to work with›    lines  of  more  than 80 characters?  ie. work in 132 column, scrolling›    the screen as necessary?  GA.››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> Yes.  goWrite supports that mode even without the›    XEP80 (a slider box on the bottom of the window) with the XEP80, slight›    changes  will  be  made  to  take better advantages of the XEP80.  I am›    still  working  out  the design layout.  The current alpha-version does›    support  up  to  256  columns  by  25 rows in XEP80, and normal (Antic)›    modes.  GA (thanks on the Wico)››    <[Gary] G.E.M.> Ok, thanks. (no problem) ;)  GA.››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks, Gary!  Next is Mat*Rat....››    <MAT.RAT>  Hi dave ... finally made it ... class was no fun! ... onward›    ...  Like  a  true  politician  - this is a 3 part question ....  1) Is›    there  room  enough  (in  your  opinion)  in  the  Atari market for two›    graphics    operating  systems? .....  2) Do you welcome a HEAD TO HEAD›    comparison  review? (The 'other' has indicated this would be ok.) .....›    3) When do you expect the final to ship? GA››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok.   As for room for two?  Well, at this point›    the  8 bit users are going to have to make a choice.  Regardless of the›    choice,  TCS  will  be  supporting GOE as long as there are significant›    sales  and  users  to support.  I do welcome a HEAD-To-HEAD article and›    prefer  one.    In  that way both the 'other' (hi Alan) and myself will›    know  what  to  work  for if either of us wanted to 'COMPLETE' with the›    other.      At  this  point,  both  of  us  are  calling  our  products›    winners...and  I  am  sure  that the 8 bit community enjoys the support›    that  they are finally getting.  In the next few months the choice will›    be  made...I  call  it  'WAR' ...TCS will always be on the quality end.›    Quality goes in before product comes out.  As for the expected shipping›    date  (you  missed  it  earlier),  I will be shipping to some *SPECIAL*›    people  in  the  next 10 days.  The official shipping date (end of Oct.›    was  missed)  is  expected  to  be middle of November. ie 14-20 days...›    also,  if  I  may  comment:  It  looks like the 8 bit users will have a›    choice  between  the  'other'  system  and GOE, GOE on cart now and the›    other  "SOON"...so, for... a while at least the 8 bit will be supported›    by two fine programmers and companies.   GA (thanks for joining)››    <MAT.RAT>  Glad to be here.  I'm sure all 8bit Die hards appreciate all›    the  support  and,  for lack of anything else to say, "May the best man›    win!"  Thanks.  GA››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks Mat!  Next up is John Nagy of Zmag....››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> (Best program...both of us are great guys)››    <[JOHN NAGY] ZMAG> Thanks.. A couple Q and an assurance that there will›    be a head to head article as soon as there are finished products. So...›    when is "finished"?  I see that your demo mentions that you will have a›    LATER  UPDATE and so that what we get shortly will still be incomplete?›    Hard  to  judge  when we cant tell what it is going to to when done.  A›    couple  quick  observations  of the demo:  be sure to kill that ATTRACT›    MODE!  and  the  mouse  goes  to  sleep  when  disk  is accessed.  VERY›    annoying.  GA››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok.    When in "FINISHED"?  That means what the›    question  says  "WHEN".   But, on the expected side, as I stated, 14-20›    days.  (BTW Your one of the *SPECIAL* people). On the update just means›    that  after  the  initial  GOE  cart  is  released and the users (those›    important  people)  give feedback...an immediate update will respond to›    those  comments  and  DEMANDS.   Also, on the attract mode, it is gone.›    The  "SLEEP" when disk IO is on is due to the nature of the 8 bit...I I›    am  working  on  a  possible solution with other various types of mouse›    control.  Currently, GOE uses a POKEY interrupt but is written to allow›    alternate  handlers  to  take over.  Time will tell on that one.  Also,›    please  remember  the GOE DEMO is JUST a demo.  Thanks for the comment.›    GA››    <[JOHN NAGY] ZMAG> I note that the icon for the mouse on the competitor›    product  DOES  work  and changes to a DISK ICON (mini) while doing disk›    access...    that's  all  for  now.   Glad to hear we will be your beta›    testers. ga››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> (ok.  GOE changes to a bee...while doing IO)››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks, John!  Next up is D.MELICHAR again....››    <D.MELICHAR> ok thanks.   one comment, as for a head to head comparison›    I  think  that  we  already  have  had  one, the competition's released›    product,  and  your  DEMO  which  does more, faster, and better, not to›    mention  less  expensive.   Question, well there be any support for the›    second button on the ST and other mice?  ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> Yes.  I am working on inclusion in the docs of a›    mod.  to the ST mouse to allow support.  The right button will then act›    as a return key or programmable key.  Also, on the head-to-head.  Users›    have  a  choice  they  can compare the DISK version of the 'other' that›    they  paid  $30  for  against the GOE cart  when received.  Or they can›    wait  for the 'other' to release a cart version.  At any rate, GOE will›    allow external additions if the need arises.  GA››    <D.MELICHAR>  You  did  say  that  there  will  be support for the CX85›    numeric keypad correct?››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> (ZMAG, my 128k version of the 'other' does not do›    that).››    <D.MELICHAR> Even when used with the mouse or joystick ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Yes  the CX85 does work properly with GOE.  You›    must  plug  it  into  the  opposite  port  that  you  are using for the›    mouse/joystick.  GA››    <D.MELICHAR>  Last  question  and good night...  On the "old" 800 there›    were  4  joystick  ports... <grin>  how about a joystick/trakball/mouse›    and cx85 at one time! WOW!  ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  The  control  panel allows you to configure the›    ports  to  what  you  wish.   You may install the joystick,  mouse (and›    CX85) at the same time.  The CART's built in routine will automatically›    adjust  to  what  is  being used and ignore inactive ports.  GA  (night›    night)››    <D.MELICHAR> bye thanks again ga››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks!  Next up is Mark with another question....››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1>  Thanx.  Sorry  Dave,  a  coupe  more... (Gun to my›    head)...what price are we talking to the "Non-GEnie" folks?  GA››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> OK.  Well, if your local user groups has received›    information  contact  them.    The  user  groups  also have a discount.›    Retail  is  $79.95.    Call or leave EMAIL for exact details.  (Did you›    fire?) GA››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1> No, no one shot me yet. There's not much of a group›    here  ask  Mat,  or  MACE  or...  Also, is TCS ready for a war with the›    other  OS?  Can  it  handle one and win? I think the GOE demo is better›    than  the  'other' from Mat's descrip, but others might think otherwise›    since they WERE out first. GA››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> Well.  Try PACS (in PA) user group.  Also, as for›    a WAR?  TCS will provide the best quality product that is possible.  We›    are  ready  to  add, correct, change or expand to meet the needs of the›    Atari  community.    As for out first.  As some may know, problems with›    what  is  now  a  marketing  agency  cause about a 3 month delay in our›    product.    Sorry.   Things happen. TCS will ship a quality product out›    the  door.    If  others  have  done that or can do that then they also›    deserve the 8 bit users respect.  GA››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1>  Good. Finally, it rears it's ugly head, have there›    been  safeguards  taken  against piracy? I'd hate to see a product like›    this  end  up  like that and I've seen so-called "unpiritable" software›    (i.e. ACTION) done. Any comment?  GA››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> Well.  Nothing is 'unpiritable' ... Action may be›    duplicated through hardware.  GOE (as well as SPX and other bank select›    carts)  will  be  extremely hard to pirate (dump to disk)... I hope (?)›    that  the  Atari  8 bit users have learned a lesson on that issue.  But›    seeing  recently release software on local BBS's proves me wrong.  Yes,›    I  have  taken  the  time  to help insure that GOE is not pirated...BUT›    goWrite and goPaint will be left up to you, the guilty users   :-).  GA››    <[Mark]  M.GAMBER1>  Ok. I really hate to see good software end up like›    that  and  while  I too think most have learned, there are always those›    few... Anyway, enough, thanks Dave, I'm done "fer shure"  GA››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks!  Next is J.STEPHENS5.....››    <J.STEPHENS5> how will geo work with 256k machines (800xl)?  ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  GEO?    You mean GOE...  Ok.  GOE allows you to›    configure  the  amount of memory that you wish it to see.  You may also›    tell  it what to do with the memory. Example, use bank 1 as a RAM cache›    when  copying  and  for faster operating, or use banks 1..4 for data in›    the  goWrite or goPaint etc.  GOE allows you to tell it what to do with›    the memory.  This allows 48k compatibility.  GA››    <J.STEPHENS5> yethanks do you know of users groups near IOWA to get goe›    ga››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> (Hmm...IOWA, I'll research that...)  Currently, I›    know  of  no  group  in  IOWA. You may contact us via phone for help on›    that.  GA››    <J.STEPHENS5> icd r-time 8 clock a problem?  ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  No.    GOE allows complete access to the Rtime8›    cart  with  or  without  the  use  of  SpartaDOS.    A built in handler›    automatically  check  for the Rtime8 and reads the clock on all updates›    of time/date info.  GA››    <[RT*SysOp]  MARTY.A>  We'll have to be moving on....Next up is Mat*Rat›    again....››    <MAT.RAT>  1)  Comment: I think a HEAD TO HEAD review should be done on›    EQUAL grounds .... GOE cartridge versus 'other' cartridge. Cart against›    disk  is  unfair,  BIASED! ....  2) Are there any potential bank switch›    RAM  conflicts  with  SDX  and GOE ? ....  3) Where do I put my monitor›    when  I have Mac/65 pluged into GOE pluged into SDX pluged into Rtime-8›    plugged into my 800XL ???!!!!!!!!! <grin> GA››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok. On the RAM...No.  Unless you goof.  As with›    all programs, OS's, etc.  You must be aware of what you tell the system›    to  do. If you tell SpartaDOS X to use BANK1 as a cache (CACHE.SYS) and›    then GOE and tell GOE to use it...then a conflict arises, and WHO KNOWS›    what  the  result  would  be.  As for the Monitor...I moved mine to the›    side to allow me to plug in my Rtime8, SPX, GOE and Mac65.  GA››    <MAT.RAT>  Ok,  lots  of things are getting power from the computer now›    ...  XM301  draws  power  from computer .... P:R: Connection or Printer›    connection draws power (ignore SIO›    connector  problem)    and you STACK 4 cartridges in the computer.  The›    power  supply  for  the XL/XE computers is NOT an infinite power source›    (consider  512K or more of bank switched RAM too) are we going to start›    blowing up 8bit power supplies one of these days???  ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Well...that's  a  good one.  GOE (and SDX, etc,›    etc)  carts use a TTL level circuit to control who is being used.  I do›    not  expect a problem with this as I have more equp. hooked up now than›    anyone  will  most  likely  use.  I'll ask that wonderful company (ICD)›    about the current draw.  I will inquire as to this... (grin) GA››    <[RT*SysOp]  MARTY.A> Well, we need to move on!  Next up is Jack Dewell›    again from Atari....››    <MR.GOODPROBE>  Thanks!  One comment and two questions...  comment: the›    user-specified RAM allocation sounds similar to SDX (grin) GOOD! Way to›    go!  question 1: does GOE run on an 800?  ga››    <[David] D.SULLIVAN4> Yes. GOE runs on ALL 48k and above machines (even›    a 1400xl! grin).  GA››    <MR.GOODPROBE> great! what is the "GEnie" price for GOE?  ga››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  The  GEnie  price deal to the first 20 (now 30)›    orders  is  $50.   Other GEnie users should call for addition info.  Be›    quick.  Leave email as to the status (countdown).  GA››    <MR.GOODPROBE>  rats!  (sorry,  Mat!)  tight  budget  this  month!  oh,›    well...I surrender the floor!››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks Jack!  Back again is Dr. Who....››    <[DR. WHO] E.PRESLEY1> thanks marty... two question and I'll shut up...›    One-=>  how  much  support  will be given to us programmer.  Will we be›    able  to write our own goe programs...  two-=> are there any plans on a›    40,64,80 col. Goe Terminal prog. (GA)››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok.   Yes.  You will receive support as much as›    possible.    In  addition  to  free source on how goe is programmed all›    questions  about the product may be answered here on GEnie or via mail.›    As for goTerm, yes 40, 64 & 80. GA››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> OK...Having to cut this a bit short here....  Next›    up is Gary.....››    <[Gary] G.E.M.> Ok, Quick comment on the power supply problem.  I run a›    130  (576K),  PR:  conn,  SDX,  RTIME8 et al.  I have blown my supply 5›    times  in  the last 60 days.  (Actually the design is crummy)  The last›    time it happened I went to a 5 Amp p/s and have had no›    more  problems.    So  upgraded machines may have problems...  XE Power›    supplies  have  trouble meeting their maximum ratings.  End of comment.›    GA.››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks, Gary!  Next is Mat again.....››    <MAT.RAT>  Thanks ...  Older XL machines had a PS rating of 1.0 AMPS at›    5  Volts.    Newer  XL and all XE have a 1.5AMP rating.  Just FYI  XL's›    with  the old PS will likely burn up (mine did ages ago).  Question ...›    Do  you  expect  that  Atari  MAY endorse one of the graphics OS as the›    "official" graphical OS for the 8bit which might possibly bring on line›    a  lot  of  outside  developers as GEOS has done for the Commodores? GA›    (Atari, are you listening?)››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> In my opinion it would be a smart move for Atari›    to  do  so.    Atari,  though, has to make a careful choice as to which›    product  and company can best support it's users and get along with the›    Atari  "style"  of  things.  (grin).    I, of course, would like to see›    this...and would like it to be GOE time will tell.  It's an interesting›    possibility.  GA››    <[RT*SysOp] MARTY.A> Thanks, Mat!  Next up is RHELZ....››    <RHELZ>  COUPLE  OF QUESTIONS...  1) CAN YOU REALLY DO ANYTHING IN 48K?›    AND  2)  HOW  FAST  OR  RAGGED  IS  THE WINDOW MOVEMENT? IS IT NICE AND›    SMOOTH?  GA››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4>  Ok. In 48k, GOE (the Desktop) work just as they›    do  in  64k  or 128k, etc.  The system is designed to take advantage of›    the  extra  memory  at  your command 48k systems use the disk more than›    not.    The  main  drawback is that in 48k, goPaint and goWrite use the›    disk  more  that I would like.  Very usable, but  disk active.  2)  The›    window  movement?    When you move a window the system uses a ghost box›    which  moves  extremely  fast.  After selection of the new window spot.›    The system closes the window you move, opens it back up in the new spot›    and  issues  a  redraw  to  the necessary window managers.  The process›    takes  longer  if  you  have  16 windows than four, but overall it is a›    speedy process.  Compares to GEM on the ST, GOE wins.  GA  (grin)››    <[RT*SysOp]  MARTY.A>  OK, well, Due to the time that this has run, I'm›    ending the formal RTC now and will open up the room after a few closing›    words from David....››    <[David]  D.SULLIVAN4> Ok.  First, I would like to thank all of you for›    joining  the RTC tonight.  It has been an experience.  I hope you enjoy›    GOE!    Please  feel  free  to  send email to D.SULLIVAN4 or to use the›    message  area  assigned  to  GOE (CAT 5, TOP 24).  I would also like to›    thank  ALL  current  developers  of  8  bit  software,  and  all of you›    supportive  users  that have put your precious dollars up in advance to›    support  the  GOE  product.  Thanks all, and have a good night.   Total›    Control Systems.   GA Everyone.  Thanks Marty.››    <[RT*SysOp]  MARTY.A>  Thanks, David!  And Thanks to all the RT Members›    that stopped in!››››                               RTC Transcript Ends›Acknowledge-To: Scott Parish <PARSONS@KSUVM>›